If Judaism is a religion and not a race, why do I see an ad for "female Jewish egg donors" on Craigslist?
Here is the ad: http://houston.craigslist.org/etc/1286458105.html Why does it have to be a Jewish egg? (No Borat jokes, please!)
Public Comments
- It's both. You can be a religious Jew and not be an ethnic Jew. You can be an ethnic Jew and not be a member of the Jewish faith.
- The child is only born a Jew if his mother was a Jew. I suspect that's why.
- Asian eggs and Jewish ones are rare and more expensive. You get payed more as a donor too. Crazy isn't it? <----Japanese egg donor
- It is a race. Anyone who tells you different is wrong. You have to be Jewish though your mother in order to be considered a Jew by race. That's probably why this man want's a female Jewish egg donor. So his child is a Jew by both standards...or he has a Jewish egg fetish.
- selective
- I think the site I sourced below answers this question (and more). In the 1980s, the United States Supreme Court ruled that Jews are a race, at least for purposes of certain anti-discrimination laws. Their reasoning: at the time these laws were passed, people routinely spoke of the "Jewish race" or the "Italian race" as well as the "Negro race," so that is what the legislators intended to protect. But many Jews were deeply offended by that decision, offended by any hint that Jews could be considered a race. The idea of Jews as a race brings to mind nightmarish visions of Nazi Germany, where Jews were declared to be not just a race, but an inferior race that had to be rounded up into ghettos and exterminated like vermin. But setting aside the emotional issues, Jews are clearly not a race. Race is a genetic distinction, and refers to people with shared ancestry and shared genetic traits. You can't change your race; it's in your DNA. I could never become black or Asian no matter how much I might want to. Common ancestry is not required to be a Jew. Many Jews worldwide share common ancestry, as shown by genetic research; however, you can be a Jew without sharing this common ancestry, for example, by converting. Thus, although I could never become black or Asian, blacks and Asians have become Jews (Sammy Davis Jr. and Connie Chung). Shalom! ~KittehKat : )
- I like my Jewish eggs fried up with a nice side of matzo balls and gefilte fish. Yum!
- Jewish is a race as well as a religion... But if someone converts to Judiasm, then they are not racially Jewish because they were not born into the Jewish faith.
- answer: because through the mother's eggs - the child could, technically, be considered Jewish. It is NOT a race. It is not an ethnicity.
- Because you're not Jewish unless your mother is Jewish. It doesn't matter if she lives with you or not. And thanks for the ad, I could use the cash. Toast a la Frances: I'll take mine poached on toast, thanks.
- Just because a lot of people believe a lie, the lie does not become a truth. Believing a lie never changes the truth, it only changes your relationship with the truth. As a judgment Israelites and Judites ceased to be a distinct "people" after the Babylonian captivity. Although some Judites held on to traditions and lineage it was pretty much meaningless. After the dispersion of the jews in the first and second century the concept of the jews being a distinct people had was dead. The revival of this long dead (and totally discreditable) notion of there being a Jewish "race' was the result of Zionist propaganda cooked up in 18th and 19th century. This very propaganda lead to both persecution and ultimately the Holocaust (TM) of Nazi Germany. So why do the Zionists continue to perpetuate this myth? That myth is their only claim to Palestine, surrender that and Zionism dies. Why do people advertise for Jewish egg donors? Because they have chosen to believe the lie.
- It is a complex issue with surrogate motherhood because while a child "incubated" in the womb of a Jewish mother..is born to a Jewish mother..the issue of whether or not that is her child according to Jewish law is still unclear in rabbinic decisions. This is a matter of trying to sideline a problem of determination. DNA was unknown to the ancient Hebrews. I thought I had explained this in great detail before that Jewish identity has NEVER been defined by Jews according to any notion of RACE or blood..but according to Jewish LAW. I also see some of the same people giving the same wrong answers about this here. It gets old, really old..in fact, since the antisemitic notion of Jews as a race FIRST appeared in the 19th century..Jews have done nothing but speak out against it..yet it PERSISTS even among people who sincerely don't have a clue they're adhering to an antisemitic notion! Because there are groups and individuals who wish to purposely misrepresent Jewish identity and confuse others for agendas of either bigotry, identity theft or both, there remains much confusion among many when that is really unnecessary. Jews are a nation people, Israel (tribal origin) bound by an eternal covenant of the faith (religion) of Judaism. It is the laws of Judaism, given by God to the covenant nation, Israel, in the Torah, that determine Jewish identity. It is not a matter of “blood” but of self-determination through the laws of the Jewish people. I know that sounds repetitive but I repeated that because that appears hard for some to grasp. People related to one another share genetic markers. The Hebrews had no concept of genetics. Jews began as a family, then as a small group of tribes and has remained tribal in nature. However, Jews are NOT considered a race. Jews are not *an* ethnicity. There is simply no *single* Jewish ethnicity. Neither ethnicity or race define Jewish identity. I repeat, it is Jewish law that defines Jewish identity. We are Klal Yisrael, the community of Israel. . *MANY* different and distinctly Jewish cultures and ethnicities have developed over the millennia in Diaspora lands. The Diaspora refers to the Jewish presence outside of Israel after the destruction of the First and Second Temple periods and the Bar Kochba revolt. There are many ethnicities that are distinctly Jewish. There are the Mizrahi (from the Middle East and North Africa).The Sephardi (Spanish) and the Ashkenazi, (German, Polish, Russian and other Eastern European), the Beta Yisrael of Ethiopia, and the Cochin of India and others, that are different as to cultural practices and foods, but it is the faith and covenant that binds them all together as Klal Yisrael. The Jewish people are considered both a nation and a religion. Our connection is primarily one of faith (religion) through the covenant of Israel, yet membership is also conferred by birth, through matrilineal descent. One may also become a part of the nation Israel by adoption of the faith of Judaism and formal procedures of conversion. One who converts to Judaism is considered as FULLY Jewish as one born Jewish and their children are Jews. This has been the case since the times of the Torah. However, one may technically be a Jew if their mother is a Jew, but apostate to the covenant of Israel and no longer considered a member of the nation if they leave it for the covenant of faith of another religion. A few rabbis have suggested that rather than identify the Jewish people as a nation, as the Torah itself calls us directly, we refer to ourselves as “family”..and while that is how we relate to one another, other rabbis say that we should not redefine our identity based on the fact that some people confuse the definition of a nation people, with a nation state, or courtry. Further complicating this detail is the State of Israel. Israelis are citizens of Israel and may or may not be of the covenant nation people, Israel. See important definitions at the bottom. The Jewish nation began as a group of tribes and our connection to one another is still from the perspective of a tribal nation. (example: as the Lakota nation has tribal procedure and law to determine who is a member of their tribe, who is not, who is expelled and who is adopted, so does Judaism) One born a member of the tribal covenant nation Israel (Jewish) may not be observant or even believe in God and they’re still a full member, a Jew. They may not be a good member or an active member but they’ve not renounced membership by following something ELSE instead of Judaism. An atheist or a secular Jew is not trying to call something ELSE Judaism. That is how one may be an "atheist Jew". Not believing that there is such a thing as deity, any deity is not following a false deity. An atheist Jew may live Jewish ethics and identify with their people, but they did not take on foreign beliefs contradictory to the monotheism of Torah and become “estranged“ from the Jewish people. An atheist may not convert *to* Judaism to become a member of the tribe because an affirmation of faith in the God of Israel is required to JOIN. Now if one born into the covenant becomes apostate through rejection of the covenant by adoption of another belief contradictory to the covenant, they are still be considered a Jew, but for all intents and purposes, they're not given the status of a member. According to Jewish law they're not counted in a minyan,( the minimum number of adults required for certain prayers and other mitzvot), they can't be buried in a Jewish cemetery, they cannot be given honors to go up to read Torah at a synagogue, and they may not be allowed to speak for the Jewish people. They CAN however, return without formal conversion should they repent of their idolatrous or foreign god worship and then be embraced again as full members. One who has left the Jewish people for the foreign faith of another people must undergo the steps of TESHUVAH , which means repentance and return to the God of Israel. Some groups may require that the individual also requires immersion in the mikveh before being accepted back, but they do not require the formal steps of conversion should the person wish to return. Jews are in NO way a RACE..other than as members of the human race. For those of you who want to claim Judaism doesn't accept converts as fully Jewish, how about Ruth in the Bible? She was a member of the Moabite nation that was condemned to be separate from God for their evil. However, she was a righteous woman who converted and adopted the faith of Israel and was the ancestor of King David. The New Testament depicts her as being an ancestor of Jesus, too. I like to bring this up when some Christians want to declare that converts aren't "real Jews" or that Jews are a race. It is Jewish law alone, not Christianity or any other entity that determines the status of who and what is Jewish. When a Jew adopts a belief that is in conflict with the Jewish religion, the belief does NOT become a " Jewish belief" just because a Jew chooses to believe in it. THAT is the conflict Jews have with the Christians who call themselves Jews if they deceptively try to present their Christian belief AS Judaism. A Jew who converts to Hare Krishna is just as apostate, but there exists no Jews for Hare Krishna or Hare Krishna Judaism evangelical groups spending millions of dollars a year in campaigns to convert secular Jews by convincing them it is a form of Judaism. You can become a member of a tribe or nation if you meet the criteria of citizenship. And the covenant people, Klal Yisrael, remain as in the earliest days of the covenant..a nation. It hasn't changed. Reform Judaism (of which I am a member) will consider as Jewish one whose father is a Jew IF the child was RAISED in Judaism actively and exclusively. Even in Reform Judaism, simply having a Jewish father without exclusively Jewish upbringing, would require conversion on the part of the person with only a Jewish father to become a Jew. Reform Judaism also recognizes that only Orthodox conversion is considered acceptable to all branches. It is against Jewish law for any Jew to discriminate against a convert to Judaism. Since the time of the Torah converts have been accepted as fully Jewish, and this is the case in all branches. We are not even supposed to refer to the fact that they are converts! It is up to them if they wish to identify themselves as such. They are Jews, period.
- I know that incest is to be avoided at all costs so possibly they need to ascertain they are not related. Also, there are certain genetic diseases that Orthodox Jews may choose to be tested for prior to conception. .
- It seems archenema believes the lies she or he tells himself and with others believe it as truth, rather than accept treaties and instead of working for peace. He goes against history and records (actually it was the Romans who renamed the land Palestine, so that Jews are the first Palestinians). And not all the israelites nor Judahites were exiled. It appears that he doesn't really understand the term zion, and wants to make it more modern and yet an old myth to try to discredit it and give greater legitimacy to arab palestinians?
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